Guy Leslie Roberts? Jason Lee Roberts? and Georgie Roberts of Jasper County, Iowa, Part 2

Circa 1911-Possibly Guy Leslie Roberts, his wife Florence Myrtle Wilson, and Guy’s parents in back seat, Jason Lee Roberts and Julia French Roberts. [Click to enlarge.]
Roberts Family (Click for Family Tree)

As we work to identify the people in the above photograph, which was cropped from the original posted in Part 1, an internet search for images was not very helpful. Our own blog posts were the majority of the hits, so we revisited those.

We have posted the family photos from the large get-togethers of John Roberts’ descendants in the early 1900s.

Jason Lee Roberts Family, 1892, Jasper County, Iowa. From left: Orpha B. Roberts, Oca S. Roberts, Julia (French) Roberts, Guy L. Roberts sitting on fence, and Jason Lee Roberts. [Click to enlarge.]
In this image, Guy L. Roberts was only about 2 years old, so it doesn’t help us much to ID him, but his mother, Julia French Roberts was 29 and his father, Jason Lee Roberts, was 33. We can see adult features to help confirm our hypothesis as to half the passengers in the beautiful old Cadillac.

Jason Lee Roberts Family, 1900. Standing, in white dress is Orpha B. Roberts, her brother Guy L. Roberts, Jason Lee Roberts, his wife Julia (French) Roberts holding baby Ralph Roberts. Seated children, from left: Wiley Roberts, Willard Roberts, and Charley Roberts. Cropped from large family portrait. [Click to enlarge.]
This portrait taken 8 years later gives us an even better idea of the facial features of Jason, Julia, and Guy. Guy was about 10 years old in this family grouping, so his features will changesomewhat, throughout the next 10 years or so.

We also have a portrait of Jason and Julia from maybe 10 years after this last family picture, about 1910 or so:

Jason L. Roberts and his wife Julia French Roberts, possibly taken circa 1910. from the Harlan Family WordPress blog, with permission. [Click to enlarge.]
Ears and noses are good facial areas to focus on when trying to ID persons through the years, and those features do suggest the man in the back seat could be Jason Lee Roberts. The woman in the circa 1910 portrait and the younger images looks very much like Julia French Roberts, in this author’s humble opinion.

We recently found the following portrait in a box full of photos, with many of them Robertses and the photos unexpectedly old:

Probably Guy Leslie Roberts with his wife Florence Myrtle Wilson Roberts and two children- not confirmed. The children may be Cyrene Iris Roberts (later Stillwell) and John Malcolm Roberts, setting the time to around 1914. [Click to enlarge.]
If you have not read the caption, would either of these adults look familiar? This looks like the couple in the front seat of the car, so we feel they are most likely Guy and Florence Myrtle Wilson Roberts.  Again, we have found no other photos of Guy or Florence online or on genealogy websites to verify this identification, but it seems very possible we have the correct people. The first two children of Guy and Florence were Cyrene Iris Roberts (later Stillwell), who was born in 1912, and John Malcolm Roberts, born 1914. Florence would have a total of 10 children before she and Guy divorced in 1943. Guy remarried in 1947 and had one child, Guy L. Roberts, Jr., with his second wife, Bernice Harper Roberts (1908-1981).

Have we met the Genealogical Proof Standard in identifying these people? We do have a lot of circumstantial evidence, but is it a “preponderance of evidence”? Have we done “exhaustive research”? This is as much as we now know, and feel the hypothesis of those in the car being, from left, back seat, Jason Lee Roberts, Julia French Roberts, and in the front seat Guy Leslie Roberts and his wife Florence Myrtle Wilson Roberts is correct. We hope that someone will have other pictures to definitively prove our hypothesis, so please contact us if you can tell us more!

And of course, that car in the second picture of Guy and Florence… People took pictures of themselves with their most prized possessions, and since Guy founded two automobile insurance companies, we could suggest that he was very proud of his vehicles. We can definitely say it is not the same car as the first because of the back fender line angling down, whereas in the first/earlier car the back fenders ran straight to the rear of the vehicle. So this may be the latest and greatest model at that time. And that is the deepest this human, not vehicle, genealogist will proceed, leaving it to others who will better enjoy the fine nuances of successive car vintages to research.

 

Notes, Sources, and References: 

  1. Family treasure trove of pictures.
  2. Prior Roberts family genealogical research.
  3. A special “thank you” to the Harlan family for allowing us to share the image of Jason and Julia they posted on their WordPress blog.
  4. Thanks also to our wonderful family who has shared the boxes of pictures and tediously scanned them so we may all enjoy. More of those to come on the blog!

 

Click to enlarge any image. Please contact us if you would like an image in higher resolution.

We would love to read your thoughts and comments about this post (see form below), and thank you for your time! All comments are moderated, however, due to the high intelligence and persistence of spammers/hackers who really should be putting their smarts to use for the public good instead of spamming our little blog.

Original content copyright 2013-2022 by Heritage Ramblings Blog and pmm.

Family history is meant to be shared, but the original content of this site may NOT be used for any commercial purposes unless explicit written permission is received from both the blog owner and author. Blogs or websites with ads and/or any income-generating components are included under “commercial purposes,” as are the large genealogy database websites. Sites that republish original HeritageRamblings.net content as their own are in violation of copyright as well, and use of full content is not permitted. 
Descendants and researchers MAY download images and posts to share with their families, and use the information on their family trees or in family history books with a small number of reprints. Please make sure to credit and cite the information properly, i.e, reference this blog.
 Please contact us if you have any questions about the copyright or use of “Heritage Ramblings” blog material.



The Clutter Family of Pennsylvania, Ohio, and California- A Photo Album, Part 2

Unknown Clutter family, most likely, from a small family album. Left image is a tintype. Right image was taken at Clutter & Young, Newton, Iowa. (Click to enlarge.)

Benjamin Family, McMurray Family (Click for Family Tree)

If you have ever attempted a multi-generation family portrait that included children less than about four years old, you may remember the challenges in encouraging (begging? bribing?) those children to sit still, get into a cute pose, and be patient while the other subjects get wrangled. (How do photographers do it??) Babies are hard too, especially if one is trying to photograph a child who does not yet sit up. These photographers solved the problem by having someone hold on to the baby. In the above right picture, the wrinkled dress of (probably) the mother can be seen in the background, and photographer created an oval to showcase the child and quickly faded the image out into the background so that the baby was the focus of the picture, not mom holding the babe.

In the picture below, on the right, the mother can definitely be seen behind the child since the photographer was trying to show the big poufy christening dress. Both of the sleeves are slightly visible in the mother’s dress, so if the picture was restored, we might be able to date it by some of the details on the mother’s dress. Sometimes children were gently tied into a chair, which may be the case with the image on the left since a chair back can be seen.

Unknown babies from the Clutter Family Album. Left image taken in Newton, Iowa- possibly Rufus E. Clutter, son of Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin Clutter and Emmanuel Clutter? Or maybe a daughter, since there are bows on the sleeves? Baby on right was photographed in Cass County, Iowa. (Click to enlarge.)

Th baby below on the left has an adult behind but covered up to disguise the mother. It does look like some of the ‘death portraiture’ of that era, also called, “memento mori.” It looks as if the baby’s head is being held straight, which is the clue that suggests the occasion for the studio image was the death of a child. Eyes would often be painted on the dearly departed’s image so it is sometimes hard to determine whether the child was alive or dead.

Clutter Family Album. Left image taken by D. Sturdevant & Co. Right image from Trader’s in Newton, Iowa. (Click to enlarge.)

The image of the man on the right with the two children looks somewhat similar to the man on the right in the image of “two gents” seen in the first post of this series on the Clutter album. Do you think it could possibly be the same man? Since photos were expensive and most rural folk did not have easy access to a photographer an image would generally be taken only with family members, so this picture is likely a man and his sons- or is the older child a daughter? These children do look a bit like the babies in some of these pictures to this unprofessional eye. It would seem logical though that all the persons in these photos from the album are closely related. And it therefore would seem that they would be closely related, or related by marriage, to Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin Clutter who married Emmanuel Clutter, since the album was passed down in the Benjamin family.

Do you know who the man is that is pictured on the left of the top image in this post? He is another of those mystery people. Since it was a tintype, the date of the photo could be as early as 1856 when tintypes were invented. Newer technology emerged within 10-15 years, but tintypes remained in use

Research has not helped us to find out more about the last few photographers to help date the images- yet. We hope that Clutter family descendants are out there who may have the key to helping us identify these folks by sharing information and images they may have in their old family photo archive. It doesn’t matter if your pictures do not have names and dates, as we could infer information about the movement of the Clutter families. Please comment on this article or use our contact form to share what you may know about this family.

Next: Emmanuel Clutter and Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin Clutter

Notes, Sources, and References: 

  1. Clutter Family photo album- thanks, dear cousins (you know who you are!) for preserving this album and sharing!
  2. Taken from life: The unsettling art of death photography,” is an interesting but also unsettling look at death portraits, especially of children, and some of the reasons families took these photos. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-36389581

 

Click to enlarge any image. Please contact us if you would like an image in higher resolution.

We would love to read your thoughts and comments about this post (see form below), and thank you for your time! All comments are moderated, however, due to the high intelligence and persistence of spammers/hackers who really should be putting their smarts to use for the public good instead of spamming our little blog.

Original content copyright 2013-2021 by Heritage Ramblings Blog and pmm.

Family history is meant to be shared, but the original content of this site may NOT be used for any commercial purposes unless explicit written permission is received from both the blog owner and author. Blogs or websites with ads and/or any income-generating components are included under “commercial purposes,” as are the large genealogy database websites. Sites that republish original HeritageRamblings.net content as their own are in violation of copyright as well, and use of full content is not permitted. 
Descendants and researchers MAY download images and posts to share with their families, and use the information on their family trees or in family history books with a small number of reprints. Please make sure to credit and cite the information properly, i.e, reference this blog.
 Please contact us if you have any questions about the copyright or use of “Heritage Ramblings” blog material.



The Clutter Family of Pennsylvania, Ohio, and California- A Photo Album, Part 1

 

Clutter Family Photo Album. Unknown person. Photograph by Chas C. Curtiss, Mt Vernon Ohio, likely taken before 1895. (Click to enlarge.)

 

rray Family (Click for Family Tree)

Genealogy is not a pastime for those who cannot shake their head and calmly say, “Well, I guess we will never know for sure…”

This Clutter photo album is just one of those things- unless someone sees this post and has another piece of the puzzle to share, it will be fun to enjoy the photos of persons in our genealogical past but we will never be able to put a name to the face.

In one of the (too many) “To Sort” file folders on my computer I recently found these scanned album images from a cousin. The Clutter family married into the Benjamin family, which is a part of the McMurray line. That marriage took place between Emmanuel Clutter (1846-1921) and Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin (1843-1899) on Dec. 31, 1868, in Licking County, Ohio per some sources; more likely is that they received a marriage license (the only record) on Dec. 29, 1868, in Jasper County, Iowa and married after. The bride was the sister of Hannah “Melissa” Benjamin McMurray (1854-1932), AKA known as “The Scary Lady” by Melissa’s own 5th generation descendants. (See notes.) So it is very curious that descendants of Melissa would end up with a photo album of the Clutter family, her sister’s in-laws.

Sadly we do not have an image of Fannie, but here is Melissa:

Hannah Melissa (Benjamin) McMurray, sister of Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin Clutter. Possibly 1915 or 1920? (Click to enlarge.)

Some of the album photos were taken in Mt. Vernon, Ohio, and some in Newton, Jasper County, Iowa, or Cedar County or Cedar Falls, Iowa.

Reverse of pictures taken by Charles C. Curtiss (1825-1895), Mt. Vernon, Ohio. (Click to enlarge.)

Since the Ohio photographer, Charles C. Curtiss passed away in 1895, we can narrow the time of those pictures to before that date.

Clutter Family Photo Album. Left image by N.F. Strong, Mt Vernon Ohio. The right image is a tintype, with Charles C. Curtis the photographer, but the names of the two dapper gents are unknown. (Click to enlarge.)

The above left image is what helped to further identify persons in the album. Going to Ancestry.com and searching to learn more about the Clutter family, this image was found:

James I. Clutter (1806-1896), with kind permission of the owner. (Click to enlarge.)

The man in the left portrait from the album looks like this image of James I. Clutter, the father of Emmanuel Clutter, it seems, only younger- do you agree? A similar neck piece can be seen in each of these images. (So possibly a man who liked the status quo, since it appears there are quite a few years between pictures? Or maybe he had a neck injury he preferred to cover up? Again, we shall likely never know.)

Unknown persons, likely Clutter family. The left image was taken by Clutter & Young per the reverse of the image) in Newton, Iowa, and the right image taken by Joseph Longaker or Charles C. Curtiss.  (Click to enlarge.)

An old eBay listing for a CDV (carte de viste, the type of photo on a card as are most of these) stated it was taken by Clutter and Young- or maybe it was by Clutter and was the Young family from Newton, Iowa- the wording is not clear. The auction image did eventually come up in a search but no longer can be found on eBay. The back of the eBay image that was found in Google had the name “Clutter & Daft” as the Newton photography studio on the very ornate reverse. An Iowa Culture website notes that a person named Clutter had a Newton studio in the 1870s, and was in a partnership with a person named Daft. “Our” Emmanuel Clutter was listed in the 1870 and the 1880 US Federal Censuses in Newton, Iowa as an “Artist”- perhaps he was working as a photographer, as they did often call themselves ‘artists.’ (And they are!) So his own family likely sat for him.

We need to clarify some confusion in the description of the photo on the right. Charles C. Curtiss of Mt. Vernon, Ohio may have taken the photo, or it could have been Joseph Longaker in Newton or in Cedar Falls, Iowa- he was active there too, at least in 1865. A search on Ancestry.com and through Google did not give us much pertinent information. All the persons with the surname Daft in Newton, Jasper County, Iowa, were farmers around 1860-1880, and we were unable to locate a person named Joseph Longaker in either Newton or in Cedar Falls, Iowa. This will take more research from someone more acquainted with these families.

Next: More images from the Clutter Family Album

 

Notes, Sources, and References: 

  1. Emmanuel Clutter – Frances “Fannie” Drucilla Benjamin marriage license in Jasper County, Iowa Marriage Records, Volume 1, 1848-1869.
  2. Hannah “Melissa” Benjamin McMurray- Melissa’s unwavering gaze peered out from a portrait hung in a bedroom, and no one in that family knew her name. Her great-grandson knew her when he was little and she was in her 70s. Thankfully when he was about 80 he finally recognized her picture (years before he did not know who she was), but only remembered that she was very, very stern.
  3. Unfortunately where the actual album is located is unknown, as all we have is a date of 2014 for these scans, but that year does not correlate with any remembered access to such an album or a trip. More mystery… and a reminder to title folders appropriately at the time they are created, no matter how busy one is with scanning in a limited time frame!
  4. Charles C. Curtis– https://billiongraves.com/grave/Charles-C-Curtis/19053670.
  5. N.F. Strong, photographer 1864-1866, Mt. Vernon, Ohio, per

    Ohio Photographers: 1839-1900 by Diane VanSkiver Gagel, 1998, page 99, via books.google.com.

  6. Clutter (& Young? or is Young the family in the photo?) or more likely, Clutter & Daft– https://iowaculture.gov/sites/default/files/history-research-collections-photoav-iowastereographers-02192019.pdf

 

Click to enlarge any image. Please contact us if you would like an image in higher resolution.

We would love to read your thoughts and comments about this post (see form below), and thank you for your time! All comments are moderated, however, due to the high intelligence and persistence of spammers/hackers who really should be putting their smarts to use for the public good instead of spamming our little blog.

Original content copyright 2013-2021 by Heritage Ramblings Blog and pmm.

Family history is meant to be shared, but the original content of this site may NOT be used for any commercial purposes unless explicit written permission is received from both the blog owner and author. Blogs or websites with ads and/or any income-generating components are included under “commercial purposes,” as are the large genealogy database websites. Sites that republish original HeritageRamblings.net content as their own are in violation of copyright as well, and use of full content is not permitted. 
Descendants and researchers MAY download images and posts to share with their families, and use the information on their family trees or in family history books with a small number of reprints. Please make sure to credit and cite the information properly, i.e, reference this blog.
 Please contact us if you have any questions about the copyright or use of “Heritage Ramblings” blog material.



School Days: An Unknown School Portrait, Perhaps in Pittsburgh PA

Unknown Helbling or Geir in this photo.

Helbling Family (Click for Family Tree)

As children across America are already sitting at school desks or getting their supplies ready to start a new year of learning, here is a photo that was in with the Helbling-Geier unknown family photos we have recently posted. The above is obviously a school photo, but the dear little girl in the front who was holding the sign apparently turned it around- there is no identification of the school or year that we can see on her tablet!

It is interesting to see a child of color in the photo, and along with the dress, this  photo is most likely post CivilWar, and more likely 1880s or later. The doors of the building look so tall- perhaps this was a church school?

Do you have any idea of the time or place this was taken, the school, or any of the persons in the photo? Please use our ‘Contact Form’ if you have information to share.

 

Notes, Sources, and References: 

  1. Helbling-Geier family photo shared by cousin Mary Lou. Thank you!

 

Click to enlarge any image. Please contact us if you would like an image in higher resolution.

We would love to read your thoughts and comments about this post (see form below), and thank you for your time! All comments are moderated, however, due to the high intelligence and persistence of spammers/hackers who really should be putting their smarts to use for the public good instead of spamming our little blog.

Original content copyright 2013-2019 by Heritage Ramblings Blog and pmm.

Family history is meant to be shared, but the original content of this site may NOT be used for any commercial purposes unless explicit written permission is received from both the blog owner and author. Blogs or websites with ads and/or any income-generating components are included under “commercial purposes,” as are the large genealogy database websites. Sites that republish original HeritageRamblings.net content as their own are in violation of copyright as well, and use of full content is not permitted. 
Descendants and researchers MAY download images and posts to share with their families, and use the information on their family trees or in family history books with a small number of reprints. Please make sure to credit and cite the information properly, i.e, reference this blog.
 Please contact us if you have any questions about copyright or use of our blog material.



Mystery Monday: More Helbling (Geier?) Unknown Photos

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

HELBLING Family (Click for Family Tree)

Today we showcase some of our wonderful ancestors that we can’t identify. These images have been lovingly passed down in the Helbling-Geier family from a time when having a portrait taken was a big event. No cell phones or small cameras to capture what was for breakfast, crazy antics with friends, or your haul from the craft store- just photos of the family at their very best.

We hope that someone out there can help us date these pictures or identify individuals. If you have a copy similar, please let us know through our Contact Form!

The beautiful photo above looks like it could be three sisters, since they are fairly close in age and fairly young. Although not a photo expert, it seems this image might be from the 1860s by the dresses they were wearing and the hairstyles. What do you think?

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

The above photo may be from the same studio, same time period, as the borders, etc. were the same. Could this be a portrait of an older sister, on her wedding day, and the portrait of the younger sisters was taken as well as a keepsake? (OK, family historians do have vivid imaginations, but we have seen a lot and could be right.) Or could this be the mother of the girls? Their eyebrows are similar.

Unknown family photo of a child- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

Above and below are portraits of one or two children, possibly taken in the 1870s or later. The chair in the photos may be the same- could this be the same child, but older? Two siblings? The design of the physical photo itself is similar, so may be from the same studio.

Unknown family photo of a young child- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

Here is another cute child, taken at the Dabbs Photo Studio in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

The London, England-born Benjamin L. H. Dabbs opened his photography studio in Pittsburgh in 1861 and died in 1899, so we at least have a range of time for when this photo was taken. Dabbs was considered to be the finest photographer in Pennsylvania, and was a close friend of Abraham Lincoln and the steel magnate, Andrew Carnegie. An image Dabbs took of Carnegie has been hung at the Carnegie Museum of Art in Pittsburgh, and you may have a Carnegie library in your town with a portrait. Back then, most photographers allowed customers to sit again if they did not like a finished portrait, but not Benjamin Dabbs. Because of Dabbs’ reputation, this portrait may have been a bit more costly from the start, and the family would have had to settle for a portrait they didn’t really like, or pay again.

 

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

We are moving into more recent times now with our unknown family, with the above possibly a turn-of-the-century photo– that would be 19th going into 20th century, or around 1900. Small cameras were becoming available to the masses, and cute, spur-of-the-moment pictures could be taken by families who would then have the roll of film developed and pictures printed on paper. (What a concept today!)

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

Here are three lovely ladies, strolling in the park or the yard, with the family dog most likely. People took pictures of their pets back then too! And wonder how long it took to get their hair put up neatly in that ‘do’?

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

This serious young little guy is resting his arm on a Craftsman-style chair, which would put the portrait sometime between about 1880-1920.  His outfit looks like some seen in the 19-teens or so, but again, no photo dating expert here.

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

Could this possibly be the same little guy a couple of years later? Or maybe not, as the portrait could be from the 1920s or 30s.

Unknown family photo- possibly a Helbling or Geier family?

This last picture seems to be a much more recent image- maybe even from the 1950s or 60s.

 

We have about 100 years of photos from the Helbling and/or Geier family in this post! We do hope that maybe someone can help us identify the time or individuals in each one. Please use our ‘Contact Form’ if you can help solve our family photo mystery.

 

Notes, Sources, and References: 

  1. Benjamin Dabbs bio– https://cabinetcardgallery.com/category/photographer-dabbs/
  2. Thanks again to our cousin Mary Lou for sharing all these wonderful photos of times past!

 

Click to enlarge any image. Please contact us if you would like an image in higher resolution.

We would love to read your thoughts and comments about this post (see form below), and thank you for your time! All comments are moderated, however, due to the high intelligence and persistence of spammers/hackers who really should be putting their smarts to use for the public good instead of spamming our little blog.

Original content copyright 2013-2019 by Heritage Ramblings Blog and pmm.

Family history is meant to be shared, but the original content of this site may NOT be used for any commercial purposes unless explicit written permission is received from both the blog owner and author. Blogs or websites with ads and/or any income-generating components are included under “commercial purposes,” as are the large genealogy database websites. Sites that republish original HeritageRamblings.net content as their own are in violation of copyright as well, and use of full content is not permitted. 
Descendants and researchers MAY download images and posts to share with their families, and use the information on their family trees or in family history books with a small number of reprints. Please make sure to credit and cite the information properly, i.e, reference this blog.
 Please contact us if you have any questions about copyright or use of our blog material.